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CBZone
- Haemogoblin
- Chuggy Microdrive
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- Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 12:17 am
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- RWAP Master
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Re: CBZone
The titles you can purchase individually for £5 or £10 from my website, you can also purchase as part of a box-set for £20 for 5 or 6 programs, so I am not sure what you mean here...Haemogoblin wrote:Hi Rich
I think it is great that your taking the time to reach out to the developers, so this software can be legitimately distributed. Even in the short time I've been exposed to the QL, it's obvious that software is sparse on the ground. It reminds me of the Memotech MTX in a lot of ways actually, a computer with an even shorter life span then the QL. But even a rare machine like the Memotech that was around for 2 years, has a lot of it's software library online for users to access.
I've found the QL a fun machine to use this past month and while I might not be as seasoned as other users on here, I can certainly see the appeal. But as a new user, I have to say the pricing of software did catch me by surprise. The titles you have listed on your website certainly do look interesting, but at £5 and £10 each, it's a little more then I'm willing to invest in a machine at such an early stage. Especially when I'm still not sure about collecting for it. Had the pricing been a little lower, it might have attracted my attention more then it did. If your an existing user with a lot of time and money already invested in the QL, the titles are probably very appealing. But for a first user, not so much.
The software listed on http://www.rwapsoftware.co.uk/updates.html does not come into the equation, because that is only supplied to enable users who have non-working software to get a working copy!
There are demo versions of some commercial titles on Dilwyn's site, and there are also things such as the QL Games Collection 1 for £5 which includes several titles built into an emulator, all ready to go on a PC, which together with the massive public domain / freeware library that is on Dilwyn's site, provide a huge amount of stuff already for new users to try out the QL's capabilities.
The problem comes to dissemination of software. I have had it up to here with various people who say - "great, I love the QL Wiki and the preservation project. When are you going to make it all available for free. Oh and by the way there is no information about xxx on the QL Wiki, so you need to add that."
The preservation project is NOT funded by the community and has always been a personal project of mine (dating back maybe 10 years) - with a large amount of finance provided through my QL sales.
If people want more of the preserved software to be made freeware, then there has to be a way of me recouping the money and time I (and some others working with me) have spent; whilst recognising that there are constraints placed on distribution by copyright law.
The answer is simple (and this is not aimed just at you):
a) If the QL Wiki needs updating - then register and add some information yourself. It is a COMMUNITY PROJECT
b) If the SBASIC/SuperBASIC Reference Manual needs updating - download the relevant html page, amend it and send it to me to update. Again it is a COMMUNITY PROJECT
c) If you want a specific piece of software to be made available for free download. Great - spend some time tracking down the copyright holder and get their permission. If you can provide proof of this then I will probably be able to assist with a copy of working software from my software preservation project.
The other alternative is for someone to spend time and money creating a community software preservation project and host it on your own webserver - hoping that the copyright holders do not ask you to remove programs or contact the hosting company to tell them that you are breaching copyright.
I will NOT be a part of the latter however, as I am a former solicitor (as well as software author) and strongly believe in protecting the rights of software authors.
Without the community working together on (a) to (c) above, then you are stuck with the current position, with the great chance that I will get more even more annoyed by accusations and be-smearching of my character (as has recently been happening yet again on Spanish forums) and simply pull the plug.
I am fast losing the will to do anything further vis-a-vis trying to find and contact copyright holders as very few people appreciate the long list of software titles which have been added to the Sinclair QL Homepage solely through my existing efforts.
After all, Urs has been running a hardware preservation project for many years and does not get insulted or moaned at because he is not scanning in the manuals, making hi-resolution images of the PCBs etc and making them free for download.
If I "pull the plug" what would happen:
- QL membranes supply would be limited to one supplier
- The QL Wiki would disappear
- The SBASIC/SuperBASIC Reference Manual would be removed as it is hosted on my website
- The Software preservation project would be lost and all original copies of software would be put up for sale to the highest bidder.
- No more copyright holders would be approached for consent to make software freeware
- Software titles by a host of various companies sold through RWAP Software would no longer be available to purchase unless someone else was interested and obtained their consent.
Rant over.
Rich Mellor
RWAP Software
RWAP Adventures
SellMyRetro
Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
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Icephorm
RWAP Software
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Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
Also Involved in:
Icephorm
- Haemogoblin
- Chuggy Microdrive
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 12:17 am
Re: CBZone
Hi Rich
I can't really comment about what other people say, though if your getting flak form several different quarters. I'd look at what they are saying and try to find some middle ground. You can't please everyone, but I like to think by listening to criticism we can also find a means for self improvement.
Like I said, as a fresh face to the QL scene, I didn't know what to expect. The software side is surprising much tighter then any other platform I collect for. Which makes it extremely difficult to get your foot through the door. The software that is available has a certain PD quality to it, which leaves you always wondering if your actually seeing the full potential of the hardware. I'm not suggesting you offer software for free, unless the original developer has no interest in the title obviously. But I certainly think there is an untapped market there. If one or two of the titles on your website where £3-4, I probably would have bought one of them to test out on my new QL. As at that price, we're talking the price of a Big Mac or a drink down the pub.
I spoke to someone on here via IRC, who tries to restore broken tapes as I have a couple of micro cassettes that dont work but have original software on them. I actually boxed them up with the intention of sending them to him. I think I'd be less inclined to do so, if I thought the resulting restored files would only available to people willing to pay for them. If a copyright holder feels the need to exercise their rights on a 30 year old piece of software fine. In most cases where this does happen, the website hosting the software either removes it or gets shuts down. I think if your putting 400 C64 roms on a CD and selling it on ebay, your asking for trouble. If users hadn't started out sharing roms between themselves, there certainly wouldn't be the thriving retro community that exists today.
For me, part of being a user and collector of old gear, is sharing the passion with fellow enthusiasts and helping them out when and where I can.
I was just having a look at the game bundle you mentioned, it doesn't look too bad and works out at about £3.33 per game
As I'm only just getting in to the system, it's a little but more then I'm willing to spend at this early stage. Hence why I was looking at the single titles.
I can't really comment about what other people say, though if your getting flak form several different quarters. I'd look at what they are saying and try to find some middle ground. You can't please everyone, but I like to think by listening to criticism we can also find a means for self improvement.
Like I said, as a fresh face to the QL scene, I didn't know what to expect. The software side is surprising much tighter then any other platform I collect for. Which makes it extremely difficult to get your foot through the door. The software that is available has a certain PD quality to it, which leaves you always wondering if your actually seeing the full potential of the hardware. I'm not suggesting you offer software for free, unless the original developer has no interest in the title obviously. But I certainly think there is an untapped market there. If one or two of the titles on your website where £3-4, I probably would have bought one of them to test out on my new QL. As at that price, we're talking the price of a Big Mac or a drink down the pub.
I spoke to someone on here via IRC, who tries to restore broken tapes as I have a couple of micro cassettes that dont work but have original software on them. I actually boxed them up with the intention of sending them to him. I think I'd be less inclined to do so, if I thought the resulting restored files would only available to people willing to pay for them. If a copyright holder feels the need to exercise their rights on a 30 year old piece of software fine. In most cases where this does happen, the website hosting the software either removes it or gets shuts down. I think if your putting 400 C64 roms on a CD and selling it on ebay, your asking for trouble. If users hadn't started out sharing roms between themselves, there certainly wouldn't be the thriving retro community that exists today.
For me, part of being a user and collector of old gear, is sharing the passion with fellow enthusiasts and helping them out when and where I can.
I was just having a look at the game bundle you mentioned, it doesn't look too bad and works out at about £3.33 per game
![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
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- RWAP Master
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Re: CBZone
Unfortunately, the price of single titles is partly down to the time it takes me to format disks / microdrive cartridges on the QL - formatting disks on a USB floppy drive on the PC is not reliable.
Finding a working microdrive cartridge which formats successfully and then dealing with customer queries when they receive it and it doesn't work in their QL is even more problematic
I also have to take into account the royalties I have to pay on sales of software (£1.50 per game) so £1.50 for me on the sale of a game is just not worth my time and effort.
Your best bet if you want to just try out the QL games is to look at the QL Games Collection for £5 - http://www.sellmyretro.com/offer/detail ... ion-1-2152
You can only use it on a Windows based PC, but then it was designed to target those who have no idea what the QL games are like. The copyright holders agreed a much lower royalty in order to help promote the QL and hopefully the box-sets themselves.
Finding a working microdrive cartridge which formats successfully and then dealing with customer queries when they receive it and it doesn't work in their QL is even more problematic
I also have to take into account the royalties I have to pay on sales of software (£1.50 per game) so £1.50 for me on the sale of a game is just not worth my time and effort.
Your best bet if you want to just try out the QL games is to look at the QL Games Collection for £5 - http://www.sellmyretro.com/offer/detail ... ion-1-2152
You can only use it on a Windows based PC, but then it was designed to target those who have no idea what the QL games are like. The copyright holders agreed a much lower royalty in order to help promote the QL and hopefully the box-sets themselves.
Rich Mellor
RWAP Software
RWAP Adventures
SellMyRetro
Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
Also Involved in:
Icephorm
RWAP Software
RWAP Adventures
SellMyRetro
Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
Also Involved in:
Icephorm
- Haemogoblin
- Chuggy Microdrive
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 12:17 am
Re: CBZone
I think I learnt at an early stage to just leave the microdrives alone. As fun and novel as they might be, floppy drives are far superior to those tiny tapes. I know after the initial release, later microdrives were pretty reliable, but tape storage was no medium for a professional 'business' computer.
This is why I'm donating these none working micro cassettes, I forget which user I was talking to. But if he can do anything with them, good luck to him! lol
I wont lie, I almost bought that bundle, before I saw it was only for the PC. At first read through, I was thinking 'Blimey! That's just what I'm after, a couple of games to run on the wee beastie!'. But when I saw it was only for the PC, well that really wasn't what I was after, what with the QL sitting on my desk, screaming for some attention. I know its each to their own, but i'm not a massive fan of emulation. The closest I come to that, is with a RPI emulating an Amiga, while inside an Amiga 600 case
My blog is all about continuing to find uses for old machines and recycling stuff people would otherwise throw to the landfill.
I'd love to stick with the QL as it seems a lovely machine, but hobby wise, its just a little expensive to justify. So I might pass it on to a friend of mine and see if they can get some enjoyment out of it. It's certainly been a ride thus far![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
This is why I'm donating these none working micro cassettes, I forget which user I was talking to. But if he can do anything with them, good luck to him! lol
I wont lie, I almost bought that bundle, before I saw it was only for the PC. At first read through, I was thinking 'Blimey! That's just what I'm after, a couple of games to run on the wee beastie!'. But when I saw it was only for the PC, well that really wasn't what I was after, what with the QL sitting on my desk, screaming for some attention. I know its each to their own, but i'm not a massive fan of emulation. The closest I come to that, is with a RPI emulating an Amiga, while inside an Amiga 600 case
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_e_biggrin.gif)
My blog is all about continuing to find uses for old machines and recycling stuff people would otherwise throw to the landfill.
I'd love to stick with the QL as it seems a lovely machine, but hobby wise, its just a little expensive to justify. So I might pass it on to a friend of mine and see if they can get some enjoyment out of it. It's certainly been a ride thus far
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
- vanpeebles
- Commissario Pebbli
- Posts: 2823
- Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 7:13 pm
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Re: CBZone
That would be a shameHaemogoblin wrote:I'd love to stick with the QL as it seems a lovely machine, but hobby wise, its just a little expensive to justify. So I might pass it on to a friend of mine and see if they can get some enjoyment out of it. It's certainly been a ride thus far
![Sad :(](./images/smilies/icon_e_sad.gif)
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
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- RWAP Master
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- Joined: Sun Nov 28, 2010 4:51 pm
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Re: CBZone
The QL has always been expensive - the earliest assemblers started at £50 compared to £5 on the Spectrum...Haemogoblin wrote: I'd love to stick with the QL as it seems a lovely machine, but hobby wise, its just a little expensive to justify. So I might pass it on to a friend of mine and see if they can get some enjoyment out of it. It's certainly been a ride thus far
However, I would recommend that you look at the games on Dilwyn's site - in particular, those by Janko Mrsic Flogel (M-Crunch, Metropolis etc), Squidgy Round the World, Rockfall, and Damon Chaplin's games (Spook, Pudge, Assault & Battery, Speedfreaks). Cavern is quite good even if it was probably the first arcade game produced for the QL.
If you fancy a bit of war, then D-Day MKII (demo version) and Ekotek Simulator are really good. FInal Conflict on that page is good, if you enjoyed playing Risk.
International Cricket by Nigel Holder shows some of the best graphics I have seen in a QL game, but alas is too hard to control in my opinion.
It is just my humble opinion - but these games are mainly ex-commercial games and excellent quality. Yes, they may need Toolkit II present, but you should be ok to run the downloadable version - tk2_bin from http://www.dilwyn.me.uk/pe/index.html#tk2
Rich Mellor
RWAP Software
RWAP Adventures
SellMyRetro
Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
Also Involved in:
Icephorm
RWAP Software
RWAP Adventures
SellMyRetro
Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
Also Involved in:
Icephorm
- Haemogoblin
- Chuggy Microdrive
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 12:17 am
Re: CBZone
Thanks for those suggestions I'll check them out! ![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
Don't get me wrong, I'm really enjoying playing about with the system. It's been a lot of fun. Today I converted my first quill doc to rtf. I'm writing a piece for my blog about the QL and how I've found using it thus far.
As I said this forum has played a big part in keeping me engaged. Otherwise I probably might not have stuck it out, as frankly it seems like a very expensive platform. I considered investing in a trump clone card, but then I'd need stuff to run on it. By the time I've bought 1 or 2 games, I'll have spent well over £100 on a system I've only just started out on. That's a big investment to justify so earlier on :-/
![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
Don't get me wrong, I'm really enjoying playing about with the system. It's been a lot of fun. Today I converted my first quill doc to rtf. I'm writing a piece for my blog about the QL and how I've found using it thus far.
As I said this forum has played a big part in keeping me engaged. Otherwise I probably might not have stuck it out, as frankly it seems like a very expensive platform. I considered investing in a trump clone card, but then I'd need stuff to run on it. By the time I've bought 1 or 2 games, I'll have spent well over £100 on a system I've only just started out on. That's a big investment to justify so earlier on :-/
vanpeebles wrote:That would be a shameHaemogoblin wrote:I'd love to stick with the QL as it seems a lovely machine, but hobby wise, its just a little expensive to justify. So I might pass it on to a friend of mine and see if they can get some enjoyment out of it. It's certainly been a ride thus farYou are just getting started and also very welcome here
- Haemogoblin
- Chuggy Microdrive
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 12:17 am
Re: CBZone
I dont seem able to find M-Crunch or Metropolis on Dilwyns website
M-Cosmic was a bit of fun![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
M-Cosmic was a bit of fun
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
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- RWAP Master
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Re: CBZone
M-Crunch appears on http://www.dilwyn.me.uk/games/ as:
Pacman - QL Pacman (J. Mrsic-Flogele) (9K) [12/12/02]
Metropolis does indeed appear to be missing...
Pacman - QL Pacman (J. Mrsic-Flogele) (9K) [12/12/02]
Metropolis does indeed appear to be missing...
Rich Mellor
RWAP Software
RWAP Adventures
SellMyRetro
Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
Also Involved in:
Icephorm
RWAP Software
RWAP Adventures
SellMyRetro
Retro-Printer Module - add a USB printer to your QL
Also Involved in:
Icephorm